Ditching ‘Professionalism’: How Work Norms Hold Us Back with Becky Mollenkamp

What if everything you’ve been taught about work, success, and professionalism is actually holding you back? In this episode of Here's What I Learned, I sit down with Becky Mollenkamp, an accountability coach and intersectional feminist, to unpack the hidden ways oppressive work norms shape our businesses—and how to break free from them.

Becky shares her journey of unlearning corporate conditioning, rejecting the toxic hustle mindset, and embracing a version of success that actually feels good. We talk about why professionalism is often just a gatekeeping tool rooted in white supremacy, how internalized oppression keeps us stuck in outdated business norms, and why so many entrepreneurs struggle to fully embrace the freedom of self-employment.

Topics:

• Stress Relief and Community Inspirations (1:15)
• Professionalism and Internalized Oppression (5:47)
• Challenges of Corporate Work (8:14)
• Starting the Feminist Podcast Collective (19:52)

About Our Guest: Becky Mollenkamp

Becky Mollenkamp is an accountability coach for high-achieving business owners, helping them stay focused on their goals without burning out or sacrificing their values. With nearly 20 years of self-employment under her belt, she has first-hand experience in unlearning oppressive work norms and building a business that truly aligns with her life. Becky is also the co-founder of the Feminist Podcast Collective, a community of podcasters committed to challenging traditional narratives and amplifying diverse voices.

Find Becky at beckymollenkamp.com

Resources & Links

🔹 Learn more about the Feminist Podcast Collective

 🔹 Check out Becky’s Feminist Founders Newsletter & Membership

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Transcript

Jacki Hayes  00:00

Jacki, Hey there. Welcome to Here's What I Learned. I'm Jacki Hayes, a system strategist, unapologetic, smutty romantasy, lover, Dungeons and Dragons geek and your no BS, Guide to building a business that works for you. This is the place where we swap stories, share lessons, and get real about the highs and lows of creating a life and business that actually feels good. No cookie cutter advice here, just honest conversations about what's working what's not, and how to rewrite the rules to fit your version of success. So grab your favorite beverage, get comfy, and let's dive in.

Jacki Hayes  00:40

Today on Here's What I Learned, I have Becky Mullenkamp (sh/her). She is an accountability coach for smart, high achieving business owners. She helps them go after their goals without burning out or losing sight of their values. She's also an intersectional feminist, and she conducts her coaching through that lens. And I was introduced to Becky via Sarah Heeter, and immediately started following everything that she does, including joining her feminist podcast collective. So welcome, Becky. I'm so happy to have you on the show.

Becky Mullenkamp  01:13

Thanks for having me on the show. I'm excited to chat. 

Jacki Hayes  01:16

What issomething that you have been learning or learning about lately?

Becky Mullenkamp  01:21

I have just purchased a whole bunch of paint marker pens, and I'm digging into my kids rock collection because I am learning how to paint on rocks as a form of stress relief during what feels like a very stressful time.

Jacki Hayes  01:35

 Yeah, I have a feeling there's gonna be a lot of rocks painted over the next four years. 

Becky Mullenkamp  01:40

I have a feeling there will be as well, which will benefit my neighborhood, because my plan is to anonymously put them out in places as I go on my walks, because I have found those in the past, and I always thought it was so fun, and so I'm going to give it a shot.

Jacki Hayes  01:53

I used to live not far from a bike trail, and it was always fun when there was going to be races that went through it, because somebody would inevitably go out and use sidewalk chalk and put, you know, these positive affirmations all over the place. So when you went for a walk, you were like, seeing all this wonderful stuff. It was great. I love it. So I love that you're doing this neighborhood. 

Becky Mullenkamp  02:14

People were doing that in our neighborhood during the COVID lockdowns. And I loved it, and it is a bit of what inspired me. So, yeah, I will. We'll see how it goes. I don't claim to be a great artist, but I'm really excited about digging in and, like, learning more how to do it and hopefully do a decent enough job.

Jacki Hayes  02:30

Well, it sounds like a lot of fun, if nothing else, so we'll see. Don't you just love when, like, the thing that you intended to do as a stress reliever becomes its own new stress.

Becky Mullenkamp  02:43

Well, this is why I chose rock painting, because I was like, I'm not going to try to sell them. I don't like I don't feel the same need to be excellent at it as I would at other forms of creativity. We'll see if that holds true, but right now, that's how I'm feeling. So let's hope so, because I really don't want it to become stressful. Otherwise, there was no point. 

Jacki Hayes  03:02

Becky, what does it mean to do business your way to you?

Becky Mullenkamp  03:07

Well, it means, can I cuss? Oh, 100% good. Yes, because it means doing whatever the fuck I want and not worrying about what anyone else thinks, not having to report to anyone, not having to involve anyone else, unless I want to, but really about the freedom that comes with being able to make all my own choices and living with whatever the outcomes are from those choices, but knowing that I can act in a way that's completely values aligned, because no one else gets to have a say in what I'm doing, and that was only something I was able to finally do as a self employed person, and even that, it took me a long time to get to the place, honestly, only in the last few years, and I've been self employed since 2005 so 20. I'm my 20th year going into my 21st year of self employment. And it really took me only in the last maybe five years to get to a place of really doing it my own way, no longer worrying about all of the ways I'm supposed to run a business.

Jacki Hayes  04:08

What finally got you there.

Becky Mullenkamp  04:10

It has been a long process of over a decade of dismantling all of the oppression the you know, internalized oppressive stuff that we learn and unpacking all of that white supremacy and sexism and, you know, ableism and all the stuff that we all internalize because it's given to us, it took me a long time to really unpack it excavated. And that is not to say that I've completely finished that work. I will continue the rest of my life as a white, cis, able bodied person, I will continue to find it. There's just no way I won't, because I'm swimming in it constantly. We all are. But I have excavated enough of it that I finally was able to start to, like, bring that work that I was doing for a long time personally into the business part of my life, and say, Wait a minute. How is this stuff still showing up in the way I run a business, in my ideas around what's professional, in my ideas around, you know, the the best, quote, unquote, best ways to market my business, my ideas around, like work hard and how work ethic and things like that. 

Becky Mullenkamp  05:16

So that, like that, process has been going on a long time, and it slowly worked towards the business part of my life. And now I'm really a place where it like, there are still moments where the voices pop up saying, oh, you can't do that. That's wrong to do it that way. But for the most part, I'm able to see it and, like, recognize it for what it is, and allow myself the freedom to say, No, I do get to do it the way that feels right for me.

Jacki Hayes  05:41

Yeah, one of the things that I found interesting was the number of people that, if they worked in corporate now, they work for themselves, can't let go of like the schedule and all these other things. But you said the word professional, and that was, I think, the moment for me, when I went, Oh, wow. A client of mine was on a podcast or something, and she said the word and the term professional is attached to white supremacy culture, absolutely. And I sat back, and I was thinking about, I'm like, Oh, wow. Because how often do we attach, you know, a black woman's natural hair is unprofessional. And it was like, wow, I've like all the ways that we use that word. It really, it's, it's not a good word in reality. 

Becky Mullenkamp  06:28

So it is incredibly racist and sexist, because who established what is and isn't professional? It was white men, right? Because for the bulk of modern history, right post in like industrial history, it has been white men in the workplace, obviously, long before that, women were very much involved in work and in labor, but we were not paid for our labor. We continue to not be paid for a lot of our labor as caretakers and parents, but we were not paid for our labor and contributions, or it wasn't valued the same way. But the move to the office space and where, and you know, that was the biggest piece of sort of that post industrial moving to the office space, and men, white men, were the ones who were first just even allowed to work, and then once women were brought allowed, quote, unquote, to come into the workspace, it was still the white men who were determining what was and wasn't acceptable in the workspace. And so, of course, the goal was to make everyone as white and as male as possible, whether you were white or male or not, right? So the idea of a suit, and how long did it take for people to say, like, Why do I have to wear a suit? And and women wearing suits, and what do their suits need to look like? And women needing to wear hosiery for the longest time, and anyway? And you're right, absolutely, the things that continue today around like, what does a person's hair look like? Who is to say what is professional as far as appearance and then also behaviors, because it would it corrects for language, right? 

Becky Mullenkamp  08:01

There was only certain types of language that are professional, right? There's only certain relationships with time that are professional. So it's like in all parts of the way we show up and work and trying to question those cells and question ourselves around those and to be clear, some of those things you may find work really well for you, right? Some people being being able to get work done looks like having an office, or it looks like having a desk, or it looks like working between set number of hours, right? It because of child care restraints. Like, there are things that that are traditionally, quote, unquote, professional you may continue to adopt because they they work for you, but that's the key thing going to your idea of like, what does it mean to work for you? It's like, it needs to work for you, right? And for there are times for me when, including right now, working my desk doesn't work for me, so I'm not working at my desk. Am I less professional? Am I not able to accomplish my work? Am I not able to show up and speak to your questions. No, right? So why should it matter where I'm performing the job, as long as I'm able to do the job and do it well? 

Becky Mullenkamp  09:07

But those were things that were hard for me to break for a long time, and I think they are for most people. And I think the big thing is, most of it goes unexamined for most of us. We just assume that that is the way it has to be, because it's just what we've always known. And I think the exciting part is when you can finally start to question it at all and say, Why? Why do I think it has to look this way? What changes if I say, I don't like that, I want to do this instead. Does that really affect my performance? Does it affect the results? Maybe not.

Jacki Hayes  09:36

So is that where you would suggest people start from when it comes to examining all of this is, why is it this way, and does it have to be this way? Is that like, where they might want to start? 

Becky Mullenkamp  09:48

Those are excellent questions to ask yourself about anything, whether it's professionally or personally. Why is it this way? And a great question, I think, also related to that one is, who benefits from it being. This way. And I think that question, because in so many the more marginalized identities you have, the more often the answer that question is going to be, not me, not me. I don't benefit from this, right? So then, if it's like, why is it this way? Who benefits from it being this way? And if you find out it's not you who benefits from this way, then asking yourself, yeah, what could be different? How could I make it something that works for me, and that's in all things, but also, I think it's really important to not just make it about yourself. It's one thing like in your own workspace, yes, but the problem is, we carry forward so many of these beliefs and the way we interact with other people that we work with, even if that is your client or a vendor, right? Maybe you don't have staff and employees. 

Becky Mullenkamp  10:44

If you have staff and employees, you definitely need to be doing this kind of work, right? But even if you don't, you're interacting with other people in your professional sphere, bringing those same beliefs into it. If you aren't asking, not just if it doesn't benefit me, how could it, but also to ask who else doesn't it benefit and why and how could it for them as well. So meaning, if, if the idea of a nine to five workday doesn't benefit you, because you have kids who are in school from seven to three or something, then saying, well, it doesn't benefit me. How would it benefit me if it was so okay, my work day is going to be seven to three. We can't then carry that in and make that an edict for everyone else around us, because it may not work for them, right? 

Becky Mullenkamp  11:25

So to expect that your staff now works seven to three only because it benefits you now has just made you the same perpetuator of these problems, right? Of dictating what's professionalism for other people, the real like excitement comes then when you can say, well, that doesn't work for me. Seven to three works for me. But if I know that my VA, her kids are in college, and what actually works for her is to work from, you know, eight at night until four in the morning, because she's told me she's a night owl. Can that work? How could we make that work, right? And to get curious about what's possible. So I think it does start internally and professionally and personally, but then exploring even more beyond that, about, like, how do I bring these lessons into all the ways I'm interacting with others in my work?

Jacki Hayes  12:08

Yeah, I thinking back to when I was still in an office, and I was working with somebody who had been, it was a university, and she had been there for like, 20 years, and she had raised her kids and all of that. And we were starting to talk about prior to COVID, remote working. And her comment was, I didn't get to do it, so nobody else should. I was like, oh, okay, so that's nice. Wouldn't you have loved to have been able to do that. And now that I'm in this online space and getting to know more people who are solopreneurs, entrepreneurs, and coming to understand why some people that might be their only option, because working in an office can't work, because chronic, chronic illness, or some other means of that, has also made me question some of the messages I got growing up about people who were not working, quote, unquote, not working. And it's like, well, wait a minute, do you actually know all their circumstances as to why they're not working and how limited our our view of working actually is, and how you work actually is?

Becky Mullenkamp  13:13

Oh, for sure. I mean, it's so funny, because I used to work before I was self employed. I did work for a while, and boy, am I aging myself, because I've now told you I've been self employed 20 years. So on top of that, I would professional experience before that working in offices corporate and non profit and small business, and the amount of time that I think any of us who's worked in those spaces know is wasted on meetings and on the amount of time it takes in the morning to say hi to everybody in their cubicles is before you ever get your stuff started up, and then you go and you gotta warm up your coffee, and you gotta make a breakfast, and then, like the extended lunch breaks. And so the amount of time anyone actually spends working in an office is minimal. And the truth is, the reason they've been they've made it to believe that made you to believe that's professional right to be in the office is because they can monitor you, because they can control you, because they get to determine what you're doing, and they get to watch every bit of it, and they get to get their money's worth by making you be there, even if it actually takes you less time, right? And what we know that ends up looking like in the workspace is people who are running around talking to people because they don't need that much time to finish their work, or who are surfing on the web, if they can get away with it without getting caught, right? Or are on their phone surfing because they don't want to get caught surfing the computer web, right? Whatever they're they're wasting time to appear like they're working. What if we use that let them have that time back to do other things, right? Or in the days that we live in now, which is like, how can we eke every bit of productivity out of people they want you in that office so they can see how much time you're not spending, so they can give you more work to accomplish, even if they were perfectly happy saying, if you do X, Y and Z, we will pay you this amount of money for that. Suddenly, when they learn you can do X, Y and Z and half the time they thought it might take you, or half the time it took someone else to do now, they want you to do ABC and XYZ. They want to double your work. Code, but they don't know that if they're not monitoring you, right? 

Becky Mullenkamp  15:02

So it's all about control. It isn't about productivity or anything. It's not about professionalism, it's not about anything else. It's about control. And that also then results in a lot of ableism and racism and sexism, because if you're not in the workplace, you don't get harassed as much, you don't have to deal with microaggressions as as much, right? And those things, while we would think, Oh, businesses would like you to not have to deal with that, in truth, it is yet another way to keep you, quote, unquote, in your place, right? When you're having to deal with microaggressions, you're having to deal with sexual harassment, the things that we know people with marginalized identities deal with in the workplace all the time, that is a surefire way to keep them small, right to keep them from advancing, and when they're at home and able to just produce and able to just shine without any preconceived notions of how it's supposed to look because of how they look or not having to deal with all the other BS they have to deal with on a day to day at work, they would actually probably qualify for a lot more promotions. But we can't have that, can we? I've gone on a soapbox, but I have a lot of feelings on this.

Jacki Hayes  16:01

Oh, I'm loving it. I love the soapbox. And it reminds me I was just having this conversation with my partner yesterday or the day before. So his company is telling everybody they have to come back into the office after having said, No, you can live wherever you want to live, you know, as so many of them are doing. And it's his first time back in the office in like five years. And instead of having cubicles, they have the open desk situation where you just grab your computer and you find a spot, and as we're talking about, wait a minute, if you don't have a cubicle, you don't get to put up pictures of your kids or anything. 

Becky Mullenkamp  16:33

What a lovely reminder that you're disposable. 

Jacki Hayes  16:36

And he's like, yeah, you Well, you're not an actual person. You're this thing producing something for them, and they don't want a number. 

Becky Mullenkamp  16:43

Yeah. So this is so important for all of us to remember that we are ultimately only numbers to any employer, and even the ones that feel like we like you, feel like your family, which is actually, there's a lot of a lot that can be learned out there about why the like work as family language is really harmful. But even those folks, I mean, ultimately, you're always a number. And I get so like sad when I see people who have all of this. They wrestle with all of this internal guilt about quitting or even looking for a new job or anything, and they'll suffer in places where they shouldn't, out of some sense of loyalty that I always have to remind them is not being reciprocated and never will be. And that is such a reminder that ultimately, inside of capitalism, humans are only seen as cogs in a wheel, and that's it, right? You are only seen as a number. And unfortunately, we all live in capitalism, so we have to remember that. And that is why, for me, self employment is the only option. Like, I consider myself to be very unemployable, because I don't think anyone would want somebody who was on this soapbox for the last soapbox for the last little while working in their office. 

Jacki Hayes  17:45

I know I have been talking about, you know, potentially I have a part time job, and that's fine, because it's actually at a gym that I climb at, so it's really just to pay for my membership. It's no big deal, whatever, and it's very relaxed and very progressive. But if I had to go back into the office. I was telling people I was like, I would be fired in the first week. There's no doubt I would say something to offend somebody, you know, in the upper management, and get I'd be fired.

Becky Mullenkamp  18:12

There's no way. 

Jacki Hayes  18:13

Yeah, no, I've learned, yeah, that's it works. But not everybody, like some people, like to be employees or to work for somebody else. It takes a lot to run your own business, but I think, yeah, the having to work for a corporation who just doesn't see you as a person whatsoever. I had an ex who was in the boomer generation, and he was always complaining about the millennials and the Gen Z's and their work ethics. And I looked at him, and I said, Oh, so you mean they don't want to spend 40 hours of their week making money for somebody else at a poor paying job? And it was with the railroads. It was like breaking their back. I you know, I'm not sure which one I'm gonna give me your work ethic? Or them being like, No, I'm not doing this for somebody who doesn't even see me as a person, right? 

Becky Mullenkamp  19:07

And continuing to watch the wealth disparity gap grow, not being able to afford a home or even like a place to like call their own, living with their parents, they can't even afford to rent the average age, I just saw this, that the average age of a renter has gone up to 42 that is so much older than it has ever been. And it is because people can't afford to buy homes anymore, you know, so it is. I hear these things all the time about these age the generational gaps and whatnot, and they don't want to work. And, I mean, this is a tale as old as there have been generations. Baby Boomers said it about Gen Xers. Well, the greatest generation said about them, that they said it about us. We say it about millennials. Millennials are saying about Gen Z, like it will continue, but it is also, I think, a good sign of the fact that people are more and more saying this doesn't work, because it doesn't the system doesn't work. 

Jacki Hayes  19:56

Yeah, let's shift gears just a little bit. I know. You have multiple projects that you collaborate with others, with your podcast, messy liberation, and then the feminist podcast collective. Feminist founders, let's talk about the podcast collective first, how did that get started? And why did you start it?

Becky Mullenkamp  20:16

Yeah, it's been a little over a year ago, and it was because I wanted it, and so then I couldn't find it, so I created it, which is the story of how most things go for me, because I'm a big like, fan of community, but I often struggle finding the kind of community I really want, because values, as you can tell, my value set is so important to me, and it really informs everything about how I show up and do work and everything else that I am somebody who really only wants to be in space with people who have shared values. This does not mean I only want to be in space with people who agree with me on everything. I want to be people who have shared core values, just about like, what does humanity mean? Because if we can't, at least start with that as our solid foundation together, I just don't, I don't have the capacity anymore to be in spaces with people who have that deep of a fundamental disagreement with me. But we can disagree about all kinds of things. Like, you know, what's the best dessert? You don't have to agree with me. Like, we can totally disagree there, but not on like, you know, is a trans woman, a woman I can't disagree with you on that, because it's a fundamental belief to me. 

Becky Mullenkamp  21:21

So finding those kind of spaces with these like core values is really hard. I have been surprised at how not value centric. A lot of spaces are even those that claim to be. They often will use terms more like heart centered or even values LED. But then, when you actually try to interrogate like, what are those values? What does it mean to be heart centered? It becomes a lot less clear and a lot more muddied. And I have found, often, to be fair, that those are spaces being run by white women, and I think often it is because they haven't really done a lot of that internal interrogation we talked about earlier themselves, so they can't really define it and bring it into space. So I was like, I just want a space to be with other podcasters who give a shit, who want to, like, who care about things. Like, are all of my guests white people, because that's a problem. If so right. Are all of my guests men? That's a problem. If so right. I want to be with people who are thinking about these issues, and I want some support and like, thinking through those issues with someone else and resolving those issues with someone else, because I do really well in collaborative spaces. 

Becky Mullenkamp  22:26

Even though I like to be a solopreneur, I can't work for someone else. I love working with others, and that is one thing I do miss about being in a like a traditional work environment, is having coworkers that you can see what it looks like when you work together, how ideas become better, right? And so how do I create that for myself? Well, I create communities. And so I knew I wanted a podcasting community. What it has become is not what I thought it was necessarily going to be like in my head when I first thought of it. It's way better than I ever thought it could be. But my original goal was just like, basically a little sort of mastermind of other podcasters.

Jacki Hayes  23:00

I know that the way you're running the quote, unquote meetings, they're not meetings, they're fun gatherings. Um, is this love seat? Idea what? How did that come to mind, and what does that look like? If you could describe that for the listeners.

Becky Mullenkamp  23:15

Yeah. So just quickly, we have four calls a month. One is a co working session. Most people know what those are. We just get together and work on things. And work on things quietly. One is an education session, so we have somebody, an outside speaker, come in and teach us something related to podcasting. And then the other two sessions every month are what we call these spotlight sessions, where one podcast is in the love seat, not the hot seat, because that sounds really not fun. So a love seat who wouldn't want to sit in that and the entire collective brings all of our thinking power together to help that podcaster with whatever challenge they're facing. It could be something around monetization, like, how do I get sponsors? Or, how do I, you know, get turn these listeners into clients? It could be something around the content. Is this resonating? What could I do better? I'm running out of ideas, you know, it could be a whole host of things. Could be like, you know, administrative stuff. I need better systems in place, or what tools should I use? And we all get together and help them with that. And then the week following their love seat session, the whole collective works together to promote their podcast. And that is this new structure this year that we're doing, and I'm and I think it is, I don't know you're in it too. 

Becky Mullenkamp  24:22

So you can say, Not to brag to myself, but I really love it. I really think it makes so much more it brings a lot of focus and intention to the calls, instead of just kind of showing up and saying, Well, what do you want to talk about? Which is what we were doing before. And I was like, That's lovely. And I do love having the community, but I think having something with a little more intention behind it is helpful. And whether you're in the love seat or not, because we're all podcasters, we all walk away with ideas, so they're really useful calls, even if you're not the one who's receiving the attention. And so I really, I love the new structure and format of what we're doing. And this like intentionality behind helping each other shows through promotion, because that is part of the reason to be in a collect. Too is the opportunity for exchanging ads, for having someone else run your trailer, for doing guesting swaps. Like there are so many things you can do when you're working collectively, beyond just the amazing stuff that we also get with the community of brainstorming and support. Yeah,

Jacki Hayes  25:14

I've really enjoyed the love seats. Those are the only ones that I've been able to attend so far. And I've loved them. One of the reasons I love them is so often in quote, unquote, meetings or gatherings, or there's always the loudest in the room who always get the attention, and then there are folks that you know that don't want to interrupt the loudest, or they're just, you know, introverts, and so it takes them a bit longer to come up with their thoughts. The this love seat option means that everybody gets a chance to be supported. And I love the way you run them in that the person can talk about what they need help with, and then we're asking clarifying questions before we go straight into like, dumping a bunch of ideas on them. Why do you structure it that way?

Becky Mullenkamp  26:00

I think, I just think that that's always very helpful. Because I feel like too often we rush to giving the ideas that would come to our head immediately without actually asking the questions to find out, is this the kind of thing that would be helpful to them? Is this actually addressing the real problem they have here? Right? We're just so excited, like, jumping at the bit of, like, I have the perfect idea, because it worked for me without, like, finding out is their situation remotely similar to mine? And so taking that time to ask those clarifying questions, I find to be very helpful, because it gives people time to make sure that the advice they're giving is going to be really suited to that person, and not just sort of the first cool idea that comes to their head. I also think it's nice to check in with the person to make sure that they're wanting advice, or, you know, how they want to receive that advice, or what they're looking for, because it's easy for us to also then start, like throwing so many things that we're setting them off track, and so trying to kind of check in with people. 

Becky Mullenkamp  26:49

You know, I'm a coach, and so that is kind of part of the work I do, is I'm a question asker by nature. Because of that. I mean, I used to be a journalist, it was all about asking questions. I coach. Now it's all about asking questions. And I have seen through coaching the power that comes just through asking questions, because even that portion of it gets people often thinking about things that they hadn't thought to ask or hadn't thought to think about yet, right? Even before they're getting to the advice, they're thinking, Oh, I hadn't thought about that part. I guess I need to know that before I can figure out what I'm doing here, right? So I find that the questions can actually be as powerful as the advice, or sometimes more powerful.

Jacki Hayes  27:24

Yeah, I have discovered that even in the work that I do when it comes to systems and helping people create systems that work for them, because I just sit there and ask questions like, literally, that's all I'm doing, because they actually know it's in their brain. I'm just helping them organize it and find it and dig it out. So just asking people, they can usually figure it out for themselves. Honestly, Becky, it's been 20 years that you've been in business for it yourself. So Becky, now, what would you tell Well, let's start with Becky 10 years ago, and then Becky 20 years ago. What kind of advice would you give those two beckys?

Becky Mullenkamp  27:59

Well, 10 years ago, Becky was preparing to have a family, and that has, like, it's an interesting demarcation really, in my journey, because my son's about to turn nine, so it's really right around that 10 year ago Mark, where my business had to shift dramatically. So prior to 10 years ago, I worked when I wanted sometimes that was 2am in my pajamas, on the couch, whatever, like, it was way more leisurely. And there were things about that I really liked, but having a kid has actually helped me with creating more structure that actually makes me more productive. So, you know, the person from I'm actually, you know, 20 years ago, because I've learned so much so 20 years ago, Becky, I would say, like, just because you can work in your pajamas and just because you can work from the couch doesn't necessarily mean that it's the best thing to do for you, and it felt like freedom. 

Becky Mullenkamp  28:45

And so it's not like I regret it, but I know I could have been more productive it had I put more structure this from the person who's like bucking professionalism, but again, figuring out what actually worked for me, I think I swung the pendulum so far the other direction, because I was so rejecting everything that I had experienced in corporate America, and I think I went a little too far in that other direction of being a little too haphazard with my work, which meant things would fall through the cracks, or I would miss deadlines, or, you know, I wasn't being as active, proactive as I could have been in finding new clients. I was relying way too much on, like one client, so things like that that were really just this, like me not knowing what I was doing and just being like, I just kind of want to lay in my pajamas and watch TV and kind of work I still did okay, but I when I think about how much more my business could have been, how much more quickly it could have been more successful had I taken a little more seriously. 

Becky Mullenkamp  29:38

But again, I don't live in regret, so it's fine, but that is what I would have told myself 10 year ago, Becky, who was about to have kids, I would have probably said, like, it might be smart to save a little more before you have a kid. Can't change it now, and it's all okay, but that would have been helpful. It might have been smart to, like, prepare for the fact that your child could come early because he did five weeks and I was. Already. So I was working in the hospital the day after giving birth like not ideal, because I didn't build in enough time. I was like, I'll take time after he's here. Didn't think about the fact that he could come early and I wouldn't be ready. Um, and what else I think I just the thing that I most wish I had realized earlier in all of it is just how much showing up truly as yourself, the more that you can allow yourself to be 100% true to who you are, free from all of the other shit, and not be afraid of what people think. 

Becky Mullenkamp  30:35

Actually, the more it resonates. I spent a lot of time worrying about alienating people. I was, you know, worried about, like, all of this attraction marketing and wanting to attract all these right people and everything. But in my mind, that meant attracting everyone. Because I thought, you know, I had to have some giant business, but I don't. And what I actually, I practice now, repel marketing. I want to repel the wrong people. And so for me, that looks like showing up really loud and proud about how what I believe in and who I am, and if it turns people off, good, instead of it being like, Oh God, I don't want to turn anyone off. I'm like, How can I make sure I'm getting rid of those people? Because they're not going to buy from me. They weren't the right people, and I won't enjoy working with them. And so I wish I could have come to that earlier, because, man, the freedom that I've had in the last few years, since really going there and recognizing how it also translates into success. I was so afraid of it, and it was the best thing I've done.

Jacki Hayes  31:32

What is something you would like to leave the listeners with?

Becky Mullenkamp  31:37

Hmm, good question. I mean, I feel like I don't want to be a broken record, so I don't want to just harp on it, but I really just want to leave people with like that permission slip that we often need to say it is okay if your business doesn't look like every other business, it is okay if your dreams and ambition aren't the same as what they tell you they're supposed to be, you don't have to want to be a billionaire or even a millionaire, and You can live a really good life making a lot less than a million dollars. And so figuring out what's right for you, like, free from all that noise, if you can sit down and really get quiet and honest with yourself about what do you really want your life to look like, and what do you really need from your business to make that happen? Or even if you're not, if you're not self employed and traditionally employed, and traditionally employed. 

Becky Mullenkamp  32:21

Like, what do you actually need to earn and what are you willing to put up with to do it? But like, I think that just figuring that out for yourself, getting really honest about what you actually want your life to look like, I think that just goes the longest way, and most of us don't do it, even if we think we do often, that vision that we've created is still something we were told we should want, right? And so we have to really get truly honest with ourselves about, like, do I really want this or going back to those questions, like, who said it has to be this way? Who does it benefit for me to want these things, right? Like, does it benefit me to want to have a shiny Bentley, or does it benefit Bentley for me to have that shiny Bentley, right? And the answer could be both, and that's okay, but to really be honest about that, yeah.

Jacki Hayes  33:01

And I think too, you know, you can have your vision today, but it's important to check back on a regular basis to make sure that that's

Becky Mullenkamp  33:07

Oh yeah, you have so yeah, mine changes all the time, for sure.

Jacki Hayes  33:11

Becky, where can the listeners find you?

Becky Mullenkamp  33:16

 Well, you can go to beckymullenkamp.com and there I have everything that I'm doing, because, like you mentioned, I have a lot of things that I do. So there, I have a program called feminist founders that I do with Faith Clark, and we have a newsletter and a membership inside of that space for people who are trying to challenge business norms. At the podcast collective of which you're a member, you can find that link on my website as well, where people who are running podcasts and want that community can come be a part of that. I also do a debt pay down course with my friend Meg Wheeler, who's a CPA, and it's sort of the mindset and practical parts of getting yourself out of debt. I have a lot of projects in the fire at all times and podcasts, so just go to beckymullenkamp.com and you can learn about all of them.

Jacki Hayes  33:55

Because there's a lot of places.

Becky Mullenkamp  33:59

Yeah. And the good news, with an unusual name like mine, if you just search Becky mollenkamp, you'll you'll find me, even if you misspell it, excellent.

Jacki Hayes  34:06

Thank you so much for being here today. 

Becky Mullenkamp  34:09

Thanks for having me, Jacki, this was great.

Jacki Hayes  34:15

Thanks for hanging out with me on Here's What I Learned. If today's episode gave you an aha moment, a laugh or something to think about. Make sure you're subscribed to my email list, that's where I share even more tips, stories and behind the scenes insights to help you simplify and thrive and remember you get to do business and life your way until next time. Keep experimenting, keep simplifying and keep learning. You.